Where did the fun go? - The Bear and Badger

Yossarian

No light sources at all, you have to play by sound alone.

bogard

I'm still depressed the colourful and cheery Jak and Daxter went darker for the sequel.

JonB

Yossarian wrote:

No light sources at all, you have to play by sound alone.

Or even just turn the brightness down a little.

Mod74

Grem, play Saint's Row 3. Then pre-order Saint's Row 4.

Brooks

That's probably as sane as it gets.

Sasukekun

Brooks wrote:

This is a thing I've struggled with for years though, wherein the medium's past is littered with titles that were both real heart-on-sleeve exercises in formal novelty and financed and technologised to the best of the Industry's ability and now you either get the bells/whistles or the risk-taking but rarely if ever both. Which isn't to say XBL/PSN/Steam smaller-scope games look/feel 'shit' but there's always a gajillion-dollah thing out or about to come out to remind you how much sheer resource a single project can actually have shoved its way, and it's routinely fucking squandered. But I mean what else is new, Hollywood etc.

See Final Fantasy XIII

Gremill

Mod74 wrote:

Grem, play Saint's Row 3. Then pre-order Saint's Row 4.

That's an idea. I've always steered clear of the SR games, because the first one was so fucking awful - although it looks like they've mutated into somethin other than their original intent.

Brooks

Sasukekun wrote:

See Final Fantasy XIII

Yeah that's a real masterpiece of profligacy.

Of course I know there were instances in past decades where major cosmetic oomph was a clear cause for suspicion about the total quality of the product, but it does feel like it's worse now than ever.

regmcfly

This is also a problem in Film. I'm looking at Supes' recent catastrophe.

Tempy

It's been endemic in media for a round decade I'd say

TheDJR

Not like the old days, eh Tempy?

Tempy

That's Mr Tempy to you, ya whippersnapper.

Dark Soldier

Problem is that dark done well is fucking entertaining, dark for the sakes is lol. Except the horror genre, that gets a pass.

Brooks

I think there's just a surplus of underestimation (that makes sense stfu) of the actual skill and maturity necessary to do "dark" well, particularly in vidyagamz* and absolutely in expensive vidyagamz.

*You'll find it in independent spaces hither and thither but again, if you know the shiny-shiny-wow is technically feasible you want it anyway however competent and/or noble the rest of the project. The "video" bit of videogames really is as important as marketing tells you it is.

Bollockoff

The dark talk reminds me I have an unplayed Siren: Blood Curse on my PS3 shelf. Might give that a crack tonight as I need some decent distraction.

Brooks

Last of Us is a interesting benchmark in this case, where you can really see a genuinely well-orchestrated scenario, plotting and characters.... straining with still being a Gears/Resi 4 updo with more sneaks. Feels like an endgame, but probably won't be, unfortunately.

Mentioning this because once upon a while the rhetoric was "oh look structure won't actually matter when the cutscenes get y'know proper good and that", well, we're literally there folks and it's not working.

Gremill

Dark Soldier wrote:

Problem is that dark done well is fucking entertaining, dark for the sakes is lol. Except the horror genre, that gets a pass.

Absolutely, as is OTT violence, horror and gore when it's done with a genuine love for genre sensibilities. Not much exceeds like excess, but only when it's tied to an understanding of what you're doing and why you're doing it that way. I think it's that understanding that's missing from Tomb Raider, whereas I really enjoyed Resi 4, for example, cos it was just lunacy and got more and more wrapped up in its own sense of absurdity.

Dishonored, which I'm also playing through atm, is an interesting comparison too - I forgive it's darkchuff because it's so well thought out, has a sly sense of humour and also, Viktor Antonov.

Paul the sparky

Brooks wrote:

I'm still not really convinced a lot of trad studios know how to employ/accommodate hirees who aren't white dudes.

Eh?

TheDJR

Bollockoff wrote:

The dark talk reminds me I have an unplayed Siren: Blood Curse on my PS3 shelf. Might give that a crack tonight as I need some decent distraction.

I couldn't play it, too scary.

Gremill

Paul the sparky wrote:

Brooks wrote:

I'm still not really convinced a lot of trad studios know how to employ/accommodate hirees who aren't white dudes.

Eh?

As in, the images, themes and design is entirely filtered through that lens of cultural experience, I think. The whole "DESIGNER VIOLENCE, FUCK YEAH!" thing.

Paul the sparky

TheDJR wrote:

Bollockoff wrote:

The dark talk reminds me I have an unplayed Siren: Blood Curse on my PS3 shelf. Might give that a crack tonight as I need some decent distraction.

I couldn't play it, too scary.

Have you still got it? I'll give you a fair price for it if you bring it to the multiplayer shindig.

[Deleted User]

Just started playing Rayman Origins again with my housemate.
That game is great fun in the same way 8/16 bit games were.

Gremill

@Sparky He's not coming, but he'll turn up pissed on the wrong day and steal your shopping, shoes and clothes.

Mod74

That would be the only fair thing to do.

Bollockoff

TheDJR wrote:

Bollockoff wrote:

The dark talk reminds me I have an unplayed Siren: Blood Curse on my PS3 shelf. Might give that a crack tonight as I need some decent distraction.

I couldn't play it, too scary.

I tried it once before but got too shakey after the shibito cop is looking for you in the house. It's proper tense stuff. Since then i've broken my teeth on the Penumbra games and Amnesia so i'm emboldened.

Paul the sparky

Gremill wrote:

Paul the sparky wrote:

Brooks wrote:

I'm still not really convinced a lot of trad studios know how to employ/accommodate hirees who aren't white dudes.

Eh?

As in, the images, themes and design is entirely filtered through that lens of cultural experience, I think. The whole "DESIGNER VIOLENCE, FUCK YEAH!" thing.

I don't know that the white doods making the games have any input into the direction and tone those games take.

With regard to Tomb Raider, I'd imagine whoever called the shots was looking at their target demographic and what they were buying. It was probably Ass Creed over Tomb Raider, so they assimilate the ideas found in the more popular game, leading to the industry eating itself.

Same thing that's seen the increasing CoDification of the FPS genre.

It's like they've forgot what made Tomb Raider popular in the first place. Depressing.

google

Guys,

This argument seems a little forced.

While there are a huge amount of games focussed on the unending ability of human kind to regenerate into some sort of Zombie (Japanese or otherwise) there are also a bunch of games that have fuck all to do with that.

I'm playing through Ni No Kuni right now. It's gameplay is archaic and the tone is decidedly full of whimsy - but it's light, breezy and wonderfully prosperous (despite the tone of the opening).

Saints Row has been maligned a little in this thread already, but Saints Row 3 is by definition the game you're looking for OP, surely? It throws everything you disliked about the tone of Tomb Raider on it's head. The gameplay is shaky and a little overbearing but the theme of what they're asking you to participate in is largely humorous and up-lifting.

I think it's easy to get confused by the huge push we're seeing with post-apocolyptic/bullshit videogames. But there's plenty of wonderful, positive, uplifting titles out there. We're just seemingly ignoring them for the most part.

google

Paul the sparky wrote:

It's like they've forgot what made Tomb Raider popular in the first place. Depressing.

Paul, the latest Tomb Raider is the only game in the series I finished and enjoyed. I did not enjoy the earlier games. They were slow, paced poorly, the combat was atrocious and I was just not involved in anyway. I would argue the devs knew exactly what made Tomb Raider popular in the first place and thus, knew exactly what killed it during the 2000's.

I much preferred it to Uncharted (mainly because of the protagonist and setting) and I found the tone to be pretty knowing. There was lots of wink-wink-nudge-nudge throughout.

Dark Soldier

The first TR was a masterpiece. Probably aged as elegantly as dried shit, but it was a proper WOAH moment when a young 'un. I enjoyed the recent one, even if the last hour or so was a case of 'just fucking end already'.

Paul the sparky

I thought they killed it during the '00s by adding in gameplay that was popular at the time. Shit Splinter Cell-Lite stealth sections don't belong in a Tomb Raider.

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