SteamBox aka Steamy Gabecube aka SteamOS - The Bear and Badger

dynamiteReady

For me, the reason why I think this isn't doing as well as expected, is because we were made to think that the Steam OS was going to be much more than the damp squib it currently is.

I was expecting Valve to effectively stalk the PC gaming technology sector with an austere, Linux based OS that did little more than run modern games with obscure, but incredibly efficient hardware drivers...

What we really got was a confusing, and inefficient flavour of Ubuntu.

Some of the other stuff that they were promising (revolutionary hardware), has also fallen completely off the radar. And that's sad, because some of that shit was really interesting.

RedDave2

Also, I know some here hate it, but it is very easy to set up a windows pc for under the telly, and you still get all your steam games. As above, valve need to give a reason beyond "you hate Microsoft too eh?" For people to use the steam os.

acemuzzy

So Mod was right after all, eh?

hunk

Well yes and no.
Remember steam for windows seven months after launch? Everybody hated it, and thought it was slow proprietary drm bs. People only put up with it because of ......hl2.

Steam for linux is in a very similar position now.
Guess which title/titles have the potential to lure people into dual booting Windows with SteamOS. Valve would be stupid not to capitalise on this.

Steam machines could very well be doa. SteamOS isn't dead yet, not by a long shot.

hunk

dynamiteReady wrote:

What we really got was a confusing, and inefficient flavour of Ubuntu.

Debian, not ubuntu.
Although ubuntu is debian based also.

I_R

What's the point of Valve creating and supporting an OS just to have people who are already Steam users dual boot it. It's done unless MS do something bad enough to encourage mass adoption and it's existence probably stops that happening.

cockbeard

The OS can run in a window or off a livedisc??

Thats the only way to sell to massmarket nowadays. But XBone, Win10 integration isnt going to light any fires either, people (me) fear pc gaming. I guess the old windows experience score could be used to help this, but surely MS are thinking that they can sell more games whilst making fewer consoles (where they lose money) but it just fractures the market

I really worry that this thinking could ruin MS in the games market, and Sony fanboy or not (Im not i just had better experiences on their hardware so far) lack of competition is a terrible thing for the market

hunk

The point of SteamOS is.......

1.Valve not being under MS umbrella anymore and striving for independence.
MS is a competitor to Valve afterall. Xbox Live and Steam vie for the exact same space in windows and are effectively direct competitors. Which makes things very awkward for the both of them.
Think of it as google with android. Google could've stayed on the windows desktop platform and never ventured out. Snuggled up close to ms where it's safe, warm, familiar even though ms is effectively a competitor with Bing and Outlook. Or they could go out and launch their own platform, be independent from ms and Windows and expand the boundaries of their business and service. Yeah, it takes great balls to do the latter.

2. MS is on the cusp of becoming THE biggest player in gaming. MS wants control of win10 gaming and Valve is standing in their way. Literally.
If MS continues to pursue the path of merging win10 and xbox via UWP/Live they will become an unstoppable behemoth which will dwarf the Sony and Nintendo userbase. Guess who can bring balance to the equation. Hint: A certain company called Valve and their distibution platform Steam/SteamOS.

3. Competition is good.
MS needs competition to keep them on their toes.

cockbeard

I think I understand that, but userbase means nothing in this context. Windows had the largest installed userbase of gameplayers for years but if they only play minesweeper and solitaire it means nothing.

There are those who will play games on a PC, and I think there are those who are too scared/confused to. Having to dualboot into Steam will put people off, it's an immediate barrier to entry. But thinking that Win10 will be a substitute for a console is equally ridiculous. I can see how they think it will help and a quick spec scan then filtering ut unplayable games from the online store can alleviate some of the potential issues, but I see them moving away from hardware and I just don't believe the console is dead. I mean PC has been superior in many ways for all but a few months of the last twenty/thirty years and yet people still buy these stupid underpowered boxes that are just one trick ponies and sit under the telly

hunk

Dedicated Consoles aren't going anywhere and xbox' will continue to exist. It's just the software and games that will be 'unified' under the hood. Gamers will be able to access and play their UWP games on either windows or xbox; it's their choice. At least, that's ms' blueprint for the future of gaming.

Also, most Steam (pc) gamers aren't casual gamers. It's reasonable to assume they're quite tech savvy and therefore should be able to figure out how dual booting works.

cockbeard

Melding the environment though must surely be a first step to no longer building and selling machines at a loss, at least apart from limited run vanity pieces of course, They don't want an XBone under every telly, they can't want that, when no matter what name is on the box it's Microsofts name you see when you first turn it on

Just my fears that they will extricate themselves from the market too soon and with too muh faith placed in their users ability/desire to play on a laptop or screen

monkey

hunk wrote:

Dedicated Consoles aren't going anywhere and xbox' will continue to exist.
It's just the software and games that will be 'unified'. Gamers will be able to access and play their UWP games on either windows or xbox. At least, that's ms' blueprint.

Also, most Steam (pc) gamers aren't casual gamers. It's reasonable to assume they're quite tech savvy and therefore should be able to figure out how dual booting works.

They might know how to dual boot. It's not at all clear why they'd want to.

acemuzzy

As ever, there are three possible reasons to use steamos -

- cheaper games (eg less steam cut)
- higher perf games (less OS overhead)
- exclusive games

All viable. None happening. So fuck that noise.

dynamiteReady

hunk wrote:

dynamiteReady wrote:

What we really got was a confusing, and inefficient flavour of Ubuntu.

Debian, not ubuntu. Although ubuntu is debian based also.

True.

RedDave2

Dual booting into Steam cant be the problem though can it? You have to launch the steam app to use the games anyway and once they are running in most cases you are unlikely to be running other stuff (I know there are exceptions but most games are full screen). So once a machine turns on, I assume you then get a screen with the options of win10 or steam os. Not exactly a problem to just go straight to steam os in that case.

From my own personal use, I always use steam for all games on my pc - even if they are not steam games. I like that I can use steam as a go-to launcher with a complete library. In this case, I'm very much a steam user and not a pc user.

hunk

monkey wrote:

hunk wrote:

Dedicated Consoles aren't going anywhere and xbox' will continue to exist.
It's just the software and games that will be 'unified'. Gamers will be able to access and play their UWP games on either windows or xbox. At least, that's ms' blueprint.

Also, most Steam (pc) gamers aren't casual gamers. It's reasonable to assume they're quite tech savvy and therefore should be able to figure out how dual booting works.

They might know how to dual boot. It's not at all clear why they'd want to.

Exactly my point and this is steamos biggest failing. It has no exclusive games or features whatsoever to compel windows gamers into dual booting. If only valve would learn to count to 3.

[Deleted User]

I remember the good (bad) old days of gaming on MS DOS 6. To get the best performance for certain games, you could create a custom floppy boot disk and modify the AUTOEXEC.BAT and CONFIG.SYS with arcane commands.

I'd be willing to dual boot into Steam OS if:
a) I'd get a guaranteed 10% performance boost vs Win10, or;
b) I get a free evening with Sasha Gray. Who am I kidding, I only need 2 mins with her.

hunk

10% boost? Won't happen while dx12 rules the roost. Sasha Gray is a serious actor now, her orgying days are behind her!

HL3 is more likely to happen as a steamOS exclusive. But if Valve did make that move it would mark the start of an all out war with ms. No going back from there.

Blue Swirl

hunk wrote:

Blue Swirl wrote:

Yeah, just create amazing sequels to six of the most beloved franchises of all time. Child's play.

To not use such significant ip in such a manner would be downright idiotic.

I'm not saying they shouldn't make great games for SteamOS, I'm just saying that it won't be easy to just conjure up amazing sequels to these fan favourite franchises.

hunk

Okay, easy is the wrong word.
I still think getting the userbase to dual boot by offering (timed) exclusives should be their main strategy. Faffing about with OEM's and steammachines is fun but it will only get them so far.
If Valve have lost their dev mojo SteamOS is going to really, really struggle.

RamSteelwood

i don't really want a reason to dual boot. i want steamOS to be good enough that i could just replace windows with it.

hunk

Now that would be a compelling reason to dual boot. Or at least try running it as a live cd.

AJ

I still think they intend it as a slow burner and won't be making a big push for done while yet, if ever. Certainly not until a bigger proportion of games released run on it, anyway. What they need to do isn't release games to get players using it, but release tools or something to get devs using it.

What I could see in the near future is Steam Link running a proper version of Steam OS and having the ability to play some older and/or less demanding games.

dynamiteReady

RamSteelwood wrote:

i don't really want a reason to dual boot. i want steamOS to be good enough that i could just replace windows with it.

Yes.

Like if one could buy £200 worth of PC components, whack Steam OS in on it, and play Metal Gear V at medium settings, or above, then that would have made people think.

Even if it was a bitch to do, the value would carry the idea.

[Deleted User]

RamSteelwood wrote:

i don't really want a reason to dual boot. i want steamOS to be good enough that i could just replace windows with it.

One of Windows' main attractions is that basically every (OK, almost every) app runs on it. It's a one stop shop.

Will SteamOS have apps for Spotify, Microsoft Office, Skype, Chrome, clients for major poker sites, Hold 'Em Manager (HUD software), Evernote, Kindle, Audible, Dropbox?

If even one of the above apps is missing from SteamOS, I might as well carry on using Windows.

I hate Microsoft as much as the next guy - they regularly show breathtaking arrogance in the way they abuse their customer base. But Win10 is awesome.

Even if SteamOS is free (vs ~£80 for Win10), I don't think £80 is too expensive for a decent OS which will probably last 3-5 years.

Blue Swirl

SwiftBoyAdams wrote:

Will SteamOS have apps for Spotify, Microsoft Office, Skype, Chrome, clients for major poker sites, Hold 'Em Manager (HUD software), Evernote, Kindle, Audible, Dropbox?

You can do most of that through a web browser, to be fair.

Agreed that Windows 10 is awesome, though. MS have done well there.

If Steam Machines are intended as a console competitor, then I don't think Valve need worry about a Kindle app. (No one with a PS4 has ever wondered where the Evernote app is in the PSN Store). Maybe Valve just need to push the following idea more - "Already got a stonking PC? Get a Steam Link. Want a Steam powered console? Get a Steam Machine." That way people with Windows gaming rigs still have all their apps, but can play stuff in the living room with a Steam Controller, and Valve make in-roads into the living room space with traditional console gamers via the Machine side of things.

tl;dr - SteamOS isn't for hardcore PC gamers after all, it's a DIY console. Hardcore PC gamers with already awesome rigs would be best served with a Steam Link.

GooberTheHat

I still think for steam machines to take off they need to simplify PC gaming. Steam OS should score your system. CPU/GPU/RAM and provide recommendations for games min/recommend requirements based on that. Eg "Your system is rated 22/14/20, this game has a minimum system requirement of 14/12/15 and a recommended score of 20/16/19."

Also an easy to predict upgrade process. You punch in what component you want to upgrade with what, and it predicts what your new score will be.

AJ

I think that should be a part of Steam in general. Something in my gut says it's actually a lot harder to do than it sounds, though.

GooberTheHat

Yeah, I forgot to add that the steam machines should be based on certified hardware, so the score was 99% accurate. If you chose to select components off the certified list for upgrades then it is a predicted score, so that would be a benefit of a steam machine over a bog standard PC.

AJ

Could be a real money spinner, that; approved components sold from the Steam store and everything.

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