What's Fun About Difficulty?
  • maybe thats where i'm going wrong.
    He could've just said they came from another planet but seems keen to convince people with his bullshit pseudoscience that he knows stuff. I wouldn't trust him with my lunch. - SG
  • Little Franklin
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    I wish some games had an option to turn down the number of enemies rather than the difficulty. Some games I just want to speed through them to see what they're all about, I don't care about the challenge, but going through tons of enemies on easy is a tedious chore. A lot of games just throw more and more bad guys in to inflate the length of the game anyway, so doing this would actually improve them. Keep them tough to keep it interesting, but cut their numbers down to maybe a third.

    The Mass Effect games would be a good candidate for this. I'm sure there are people who would enjoy the story content but can't be bothered with grinding through oceans of Reapers and Geth. The final London mission would also be much less of a headache.
  • @MK

    I'd never bother even trying that.  Single player one-on-one fighters are the absolute worst for cheapness/unfairness.  Get thrown by M Bison with enough energy left to survive the throw?  No you didn't, you lose.  Computer character moves seemed to suck an extra 15% out of the last knockings of an energy bar.
  • Blue Swirl
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    Vela wrote:
    Blue Swirl wrote:
    As someone who did Halo 3 on Legendary with a few skulls active when he got bored, I can tell you the secret there was to snipe them first. ;)
    Good advice that. Shoot them before they shoot you. Also, dont die. :P

    As I say to my brother when he's struggling with a game "Have you tried being less shit?". ;)
    Moot_Geeza wrote:
    I distinctly remember a blind panic in 4 player online co-op, and not a single beam rifle between us.  Then a decision that someone should hang back and stand still for a while so the other three players could respawn with non gleeful abandon.

    You can dome the Jackals with the BR in that section. A sniper or beam rifle will help, but it's not 100% necessary.
    For those with an open mind, wonders always await! - Kilton (monster enthusiast)
  • When I was a kid, car games like outrun stumped me. 

    I always thought that a good car game meant you would have to acellerate and go as fast as possible throughout. This was why i didn't complete Outrun in the arcade. 

    Would anyone agree that games seem to have less bosses these days? I remember going to arcades and seeing a boss at the end of EVERY level in every game.
    He could've just said they came from another planet but seems keen to convince people with his bullshit pseudoscience that he knows stuff. I wouldn't trust him with my lunch. - SG
  • The whole point of bosses is to make you go wow before killing you brutally thereby distracting you from the robbed 50p.

    Bosses often nowadays seem to be what appear to be a super tough baddie that eventually gets integrated into the normal baddie mix later on.
  • Halo on Normal is a bit rubbish. Heroic pretty much essential for decent gameplay. Thinkers like Braid are always welcome, and the slow ramp up of Mario always impresses.
  • Little Franklin
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    Couldn't see the point in hard games when I was young. Winning is more fun than losing, so why play on hard?

    I think it was Syphon Filter 2 that made me change my mind. Beating it was mostly just a case of memorising enemy movements, but if felt great when I could finally run through a level getting perfect kills without taking damage.
  • wonderbanana
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    Im struggling to think of any games bar Halo I like on hard.

    Some games have hard mode when its pointless, others get it right by having no hard mode - see GTAV as one example.0
  • Seems like most games actually make sense on hard. Like that's how they were designed and then they dialed it down for normal.
    "..the pseudo-Left new style.."
  • Has the old Japanese/PAL difficulty tweaking been mentioned so far?  I can't remember which way it tended to go off the top of my head.  Normal modes were shifted to Easy modes and whatnot.  Rocket Knight Adventures, loads of others.
  • Little Franklin
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    Seems to me a lot of games are designed for normal, with the enemy hit points just dialed up for hard mode, whether that will break the game or not. But depends on the game I guess.
  • Little Franklin
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    I seem to remember there was a game that was meant to be easier on PAL just because it had to run at a lower frame rate and was therefore slower.
  • davyK
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    Modern shmups probably have the most finely tuned difficulty levels. Playing Mushi Futari on anything higher than default and I find difficulty to be hilarious.
    Holding the wrong end of the stick since 2009.
  • Problem with shmups is that bullet-hell is such a niche that devs are only really catering for the hardcore now, who increasingly want moremoremorebulletohello.

    Same for the harder bms stuff - who the fuck plays anything lower than an 8 in that? Not many, I reckon.

    I mean, what % of players could actually clear Mushi Ultra, or a 6** bms song? Fuck all, I'd wager.

    I used to think I could clear / do any game on any diff if I just cracked at it long enough. Not the case with the above examples. Gettin' old. Bms in particular I find physically grueling, let alone difficult to keep up with.

    Trials and Meat Boy hit the right level for me in recent times, as someone else mentioned. Then again, what if Trials is still going in 15+ years time? Possible a similar sitch?.. dedicated following, all pretty decent at the game anyway, scrap the lower diffs, get to the meat of Hard+ earlier?

    Meh, I'm waffling here really.

    I would like a return to hard platformers though, and proper ranking systems in things. This 'everyone levels up and we have fun' bullshit is, well, bullshit. Teach dem kids early, life ain't fair! Some other fucker *will* beat you. Get used to it.
  • davyK
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    Trials manages it. Meat Boy just annoyed me which surprised me as I'm a platformer head. See what you mean though.
    Holding the wrong end of the stick since 2009.
  • If you're presenting a pure gymnastic challenge like Meat Boy, instant reloads are pretty much mandatory.

    For something with a bit more interest in measured visual narrative and progress, you can be a bit slacker, albeit that you have to somehow work the respawn/extra lives mechanic into the fiction.
  • Little Franklin
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    Yeah I'd like some harder platformers. Love a good platformer.

    I guess they have the reverse problem from shmups. Shmups are for hardcore nerds so must be mega hard. Platformers are for children and so must be piss easy.
  • I like adaptive difficulty and various tricks to make you feel like more of a hero but they don't work for everything. A change in a memory based shmup will make it harder, even if it's less things trying to kill you.

    Good rubber banding should make you fell like you're constantly in the thick of it and you just snatched victory in the last second. Burnout does this well but you're more likely to lose by taking a wrong turn early on. The AI stays with you, slows down when you crash, speeds up when you boost, then surges a little a few hundred metres from the end eases off in the last 100m or so. Class.

    Halo does something sweet where the last few pixels of health is worth about the same as quarter of your bar so you often feel like you just scraped thru.
    "..the pseudo-Left new style.."
  • I do think that there's very little excuse in 'looser' games for not randomising enemy spawn points and even numbers to an extent. Dark Souls would've been a lot better without the roteness of mob placement.
  • davyK
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    SMB2 JPN aka Lost Levels was enjoyable, as was the Special World Courses in SMW.

    I didn't get on with the controls in Meat Boy - but I'm using a cheapo control pad on my PC. May go back to it and try keyboard.
    Holding the wrong end of the stick since 2009.
  • Meat Boy's biggest issue was the presentation. Deeply unappealing for a variety of reasons.
  • I had no problem with the presentation of Meat Boy, quite liked it in fact, but I did have to overlook almost every visual aspect of Ms.'Splosion Man because I enjoyed the mechanics so much.
  • I can't wait to pirate the linux version of that.
    We're never doing Linux because that's dumb. I don't care what anybody says, nobody plays games on Linux.

    But Linux... I can't wait for some Linux programmer guy to e-mail me and say "I'll port this for free", because I already have the e-mail already written that I'm going to send back to him, and basically tell him to fuck off, indefinitely.

    All this when anyone could see steam were obviously gearing up to a serious move on Linux. Then it came out on Linux. So fuck those guys. I'll yarr it or Humble with a 0% dev share.
    "..the pseudo-Left new style.."
  • Bollockoff
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    The recent rise of indie roguelikes is partly a reaction to the general ease of mainstream gaming these days I rekkon.
  • Dark Soldier
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    Bollockoff wrote:
    The recent rise of indie roguelikes is partly a reaction to the general ease of mainstream gaming these days I rekkon.

    Any recommendations?
  • Galek Z looks fan fucking tastic.
    "..the pseudo-Left new style.."
  • Bollockoff
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    FTL, yar. Teleglitch is also good.
  • davyK
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    Brooks wrote:
    Meat Boy's biggest issue was the presentation. Deeply unappealing for a variety of reasons.

    The look of it didn't help either. Nothing to do with the lo-fi design. I consider VVVVVV to be quite lovely looking. Just had a rough-by-design look that didn't appeal
    Holding the wrong end of the stick since 2009.

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